I find the current situation deeply sorrowful, harrowing. There is one aspect of it that I think needs clarification, a clarification that will help thinking about the situation as a whole, and that is the analogies between Hitler, the Nazis and Hamas.
So, as the author of Explaining Hitler, having spent some time studying the subject, I thought I would point out a few differences.
–The Hamas founding covenant explicitly calls for the extermination of all Jews. Hitler never made total extermination an official plank of the the Nazi party platform. (see Holocaust scholar Omer Bartov’s article in the February 2, 2004 issue of The New Republic. He points to the extermiationist 7th article of the founding Hamas covenanat which cites the Hadith (saying of the prophet). Here is a translation of the Hadith in a deeply disturbing summary of Hamas’ exterminationist anti-semitism by the Brown University scholar Andrew Bostom:
“The Prophet, Allah’s prayer and peace be upon him, says: “The hour of judgment shall not come until the Muslims fight the Jews and kill them, so that the Jews hide behind trees and stones, and each tree and stone will say: ‘Oh Muslim, oh servant of Allah, there is a Jew behind me, come and kill him,’ except for the Gharqad tree, for it is the tree of the Jews.” (Sahih Muslim, Book 41, Number 6985)
In other words, Hamas is not committed merely to the political goal of expelling Jews from the land of Israel but to what they believe is a sacred religious goal of exterminating all Jews everywhere behind every tree in creation. (I’m not pinning any hopes on “the Gharqad tree”). I’d suggest those who deceive themselves into believing Hamas is just another Palestinian rights group, maybe a little on the extreme side, read the whole Bostom article. The exterminationist anti-semitism of Hamas is more excessive than Hitler’s.
So that’s one difference.
–Hitler made efforts to conceal the purpose of the death camps and distanced himself from them, avoided written as opposed to oral orders for the Final Solution. Not because he felt any shame about them, but because he felt knowledge of the death camps might be counter-productive to the Nazis political goals. Hamas makes no effort to conceal the fact that it wants to kill Jewish civilians, not just combatants, but women and children–all Jews (it’s in the charter, remember)—because Hamas feels this will make them more popular.
Ron Rosenbaum, Writer 
While I understand your points and think Hamas is an evil organization, they will never approach the level of the Nazi’s until they open death camps and kill millions.
Comment by The Intellectual Redneck — January 5, 2009 @ 3:43 am |
Mr. Rosenbaum,
This essay is spot on! Europe collectively buries its head in the sand and, by doing so, encourages the real “final solution.” Meanwhile the US government fails to dress-down those countries (including allies) that rhetorically support Hamas, as well as failing to act as an ally toward Israel, with respect to those countries arming and directly aiding and abetting Hamas. The Palestinians and their partners in this Jew-hating axis of evil have taught genocide for generations and then claim victimhood when Israel rightfully defends itself. In essence, supporting Hamas is tantamount to supporting genocide.
My thoughts on this issue are here: http://markepstein.wordpress.com/2009/01/04/why-are-the-jew-monkeys-winning/
Comment by Mark Epstein — January 5, 2009 @ 3:59 am |
RON ROSENBAUM HAS THE CREDENTIALS TO WRITE THIS VALUABLE AND INSIGHTFUL ESSAY COMPARING HITLER AND THE NAZI PHILOSOPHY WITH HAMAS.
LIBERAL JEWS, WAKE UP. DON’T COUNT ON THOSE GHARQAD TREES TO PROTECT YOU FROM FANATIC MOSLEM ANGER, THOSE GHARDQAD TREES YOU BOUGHT ON EBAY FROM KHALID MESHAAL FROM DAMASCUS SYRIA. THOSE ARE FOOLS’ TREES. THEY’RE KNOCK OFFS.
RON ROSENBAUM, YASHER KOACH!
Comment by myron sugerman — January 5, 2009 @ 4:38 am |
Splendid!
And no, don’t hold your breath waiting for the media. That would be suicidal.
Comment by Poul Højlund, Denmark — January 5, 2009 @ 5:21 am |
Mr. Rosenbaum;
I enjoyed your book, I even bought the thing in hardcover.
“So that’s a big difference too. (and perhas a reason the current Czech government supports the state of Israel.) But imagine, liberals serving as the defenders of the continuing rule of a Nazi-like party more extreme than Hitler’s! (Talk about “shtetl police”)”
I offer one Emil Maurice, a Jewish SS man:
(5 bodies, 6 pairs of jackboots…)
Once Hamas and their ilk have been utterly defeated, we can have the luxury of contemplating the likes of the latter day Maurices with the attention they deserve.
Until then, they are aiding and abetting those who are, like pirates, the enemies of all humanity.
And as to your point, Hamas WOULD be Nazis, if they were competent enough to actually run a government and disciplined enough to apply a systematic approach to the matter.
I don’t have any illusions, and I don’t think you do either, that the Endlossung would have remained confined to the borders of the Greater German Reich,it didn’t…Vichy French and Italian Jews got the same treatment as German and Polish Jews, did they not?.
The Germans were simply taking things one step at a time. Hamas wants it all now.
Hamas and the National Socialists could not exist without their exterminationist anti-semitism.
It’s also their weakness. The Germans delayed munitions trains to the Soviet front so that the boxcars would get to Auschwitz.
Hamas would cheerfully let the Gazans live in want and hunger and disease so that they could recruit more terrorists.
That is the essential and identical similarity between the two. The differences are, frankly, morally trivial.
It’s all about killing Jews.
And if they ever run out Jews, they’ll find someone else to kill.
Comment by Bilgeman — January 5, 2009 @ 5:29 am |
8. Bilgeman: It’s all about killing Jews.
And if they ever run out Jews, they’ll find someone else to kill.
This entire war is for the reinstatement of Fatah.
Fatah is a terrorists organization and Abbas talks about Israels inhuman attack on Gaza, but in private he is jumping with joy.
Olmert and the Knesset know that Mahmoud Abbas is a terrorists but he is a smart terrorist and will not throw rockets into Israel.
All the Arabic countries wants rid of Hamas and Iran and the Israelis are doing the job.
If… If, Israel doesn’t quit,
Abbas and Fatah will be in power in Gaza before Spring.
Comment by radical jew — January 5, 2009 @ 5:53 am |
Intellectual redneck
The reason Hamas hasn’t opened camps is not because they are less evil but because they don’t have might for capturing Jews and killing them. Also, the Nazis were interested in exterminating the Jews, period. They weren’t keen at preventing their suffering (so they didn’t purge sadists or protect Jews against Ukarainian mobs) but weren’t interested in their suffering. Their goal was speed and efficiency.
But if Hamas had the means of its ambitions, its victims would consider fortunate those who were gassed at Auschwitz or were shot by the Einsatztruppen. The cruelty in the deaths would be similar or worse to what happened in Rwanda but with ten times more victims.
Meditate that these are the people who have tried to blow a maternity. Meditate that Sammy Kuntar, who, in cold blod, crushed the skull of a four years old girl (instead of shooting her) is a <b<hero for Hamas.
Comment by JFM — January 5, 2009 @ 6:01 am |
A modest proposal: If we believe what we say we do, let’s stopping saying, “the prophet” but simply “Muhammed”. Why even give the guy the slightest sheen of respectability? He’s an egomanical loon like Hitler, but without a conscience.
Comment by epb — January 5, 2009 @ 6:04 am |
No,NO,NO Israel is the best student of Hitler
Comment by Rekha brown — January 5, 2009 @ 6:20 am |
Nazis dressed better.
Comment by Lifeofthemind — January 5, 2009 @ 6:40 am |
I pray that Israel ignores the useless UN and that the Americans and what few sensible people/countries are left in the world will manage to get Israel the time and support they need to rid that nest of cockroaches and barbaric maniacs controling Gaza. Go Israel! Finish what you’ve started! The sane and sensible people of the world are behind, beside you, and with you!
Comment by Don — January 5, 2009 @ 6:40 am |
Some Muslim scholars now think that Muhammed probably never existed.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122669909279629451.html
Hopefully this fracture line will grow within Islam to make it a more interpretive religion.
Comment by howard — January 5, 2009 @ 6:46 am |
Ron:
The reality is that Progressives did march arm-in-arm with the Nazis. They gave their unqualified support to Hitler during the period of the Nazi-Soviet alliance. After June 22, 1941 Progressives did not fight for freedom, they fought for Stalin. Had the Soviets concluded a separate truce with Nazi Germany Progressives would have acted as they do today. Remember this: No red-brown alliance, no Holocaust.
Comment by jerryofva — January 5, 2009 @ 7:13 am |
No, no no. Rekha brown is the worst student of history.
Comment by Fred Beloit — January 5, 2009 @ 7:38 am |
Rekha Brown
Here it is. Repudiate it now.
http://memri.org/bin/articles.cgi?Page=archives&Area=sd&ID=SP109206
Comment by Valerie — January 5, 2009 @ 7:38 am |
[…] at birth? Jump to Comments RonRosenbaum.com » Some Differences Between Hamas and the Nazi Party. Hamas and Nazis, that is. In case you were wondering how 2 different Jew-hating organizations went […]
Pingback by Separated at birth? « True Sailing Is Dead — January 5, 2009 @ 8:02 am |
I say: “A pox on both your houses”, they are just as guilty in the eyes of god.
Comment by ECF — January 5, 2009 @ 8:06 am |
All we can see is that Israelis are acting as Nazis of 21 st cetntury. They kill civilians, murder children, organise concentration camps and have propaganda to twist all of that. Simply modern Israel is the same as Hitlers Germany.
Comment by Stefan — January 5, 2009 @ 8:10 am |
Worse! than Hitler!
Comment by BJ — January 5, 2009 @ 8:16 am |
From the perspective of American politics, I cannot grasp the term “liberal Jew”, which seems an oxymoron. It tells me those who accept such a designation care more about their pampered, “old money” lifestyle than about their brothers and sisters in Israel. Perhaps liberal, western Jews will begin to understand the struggle when leftist European and American leaders turn their backs as radical Muslims openly burn synagogues and attack Jewish citizens on the streets of EU/US cities, while “good people” watch and do nothing. Israel will become the only refuge, and liberalism will no longer be an alternative.
Comment by Saltherring — January 5, 2009 @ 8:22 am |
Three cheers for Ron Rosenbaum! Only one qualm, but it requires a bit of a story: Last week I got into a big argument via email with members of a “havurah” (a far-left-wing PC synagogue) to which I once belonged, the most vocal members of which seemed to believe that any attempt by Israel to defend itself is tantamount to a war crime. I said to another friend who had gotten disgusted with this group that these people would talk, talk, talk to SS guards shoving them into gas chambers, but of course they would never put their precious selves in danger like that; instead they are happy to sacrifice other Jews’ lives and moralize from the sidelines.
So Ron, please don’t call these people liberals. Liberals are people like Bobby Kennedy, who stood up for Israel and was murdered for it. People who condemn Israel in these circumstances are anything but liberal.
Comment by Martin Berman-Gorvine — January 5, 2009 @ 8:29 am |
Hitler hated Jews, but it was not until the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem gave him the idea of extinction (taken from the Sunna of Mohammed when he annihilated the Jews of Medina), that the death camps were planned. Only 6.8% of Mein Kampf is Jew hatred, whereas, 10.6% of the Koran is involved in Jew hatred. So the Koran has more Jew hatred than Mein Kampf
Read the whole essay
http://www.politicalislam.com/blog/refuting-counter-terrorism-dhimmitude/
Comment by susan — January 5, 2009 @ 8:52 am |
On the general subject of what a “liberal” would countenance as appropriate force in response to an aggressor, your comments on Hitler and Hamas in view of contemporary attitudes toward the Israeli response to Hamas aggression bring to mind, for me, an intellectual debate of WWII on the subject of justifiable force and warfare, which was summarized in a fashion still accessible today in the Powell/Pressburger film, The Life and Death of Colonel Blimp. Late in the film, which was produced in England in the middle of WWII the elderly “Colonel Blimp”, an archetype of the disappearing patrician Edwardian, has a discussion with a German exile friend of the same era regarding the manner of fighting the Nazis. Blimp states that the horrors of Nazi atrocities should not induce the allies to conduct war in an equally barbaric fashion. His German friend atypically disagrees with him, stating that Nazism represents an evil so insidious that its swift and comprehensive defeat by any and all means is not only justified but required as a just moral statement by all humanity.
These sentiments lay behind the West’s support of indiscriminate aerial bombing over Germany and other tactics. Your piece aptly illustrates a resurfacing the the “Blimp” perspective in the use of force against aggressors, even evil ones, in our time, perhaps (and definitely in many demonstrable instances) disingenuously as a cover for anti-Israeli sentiment. Pity that there is not a full throated advocacy in the West in favor of deadly force against evil aggression of the likes of Hamas similar to that which justified Allied bombing in WWII. Not only would such a position clearly stake out a firm opposition to political evil, it would also serve as a rallying cry against it in an environment too willing to tolerate it.
Comment by Wardboss — January 5, 2009 @ 8:54 am |
Hello All:
To: Intellectual Redneck – You wrote, “While I understand your points and think Hamas is an evil organization, they will never approach the level of the Nazi’s until they open death camps and kill millions.”
Aren’t you somewhat missing the point? Hitler lifted Germany out of the depression and again made that nation a world power by the late 1930s, and Germany was an incipient superpower when it was finally brought down by the combined efforts of the Anglo-American and Soviet alliance. Although it seems historically inevitable now that the Allies should win, it was in fact a very near-run thing. The allies could very well have lost the war had one of the key turning points gone the other way. Let us not forget the cost; Soviet Russia suffered mnay millions of dead and wounded to turn the tide against the Germans and finally take Berlin.
In short, Nazi Germany married an evil ideology with the means of enforcing it – political, military, social, and economic.
Hamas’ ideology is every bit as evil as the Nazis, indeed Hamas takes some of its intellectual scaffolding from National Socialism. The Muslim Brotherhood, the prototype of many of today’s terrorist organzations, began in earnest under Haj Amin Al Husseini, the Grand Mufti of Jersusalem. Husseini was personally close with Hitler and Himmler, and supported the “Final Solution” to exterminate Jews.
The difference between Nazism and Hamas, then, is less one of intent than means of carrying out that intent.
In the 1930s, the civilized world made the horrible mistake of not taking Hitler at his word when he forthrightly stated in print and in speeches the murderous intent of National Socialism. We paid for it with the most costly and destructive war in human history. Hamas, Hezbollah, and the rest of the Islamic fascists have likewise made no attemept to hide their maleviolent goals. We would do well to take them at their word, or face the consequences, possibly nuclear blackmail.
Sun Tzu notes again and again that a wise strategist strikes where and when his enemy is weakest. Hamas does not yet possess a nuclear device, but do we really need them to do so before we take them seriously as a threat?
To: Poul Højlund, Denmark – My 80-year old Danish mother survived the Nazi occupation of Denmark; she and her family helped smuggle Jews and others wanted by the Nazis out of Denmark to Sweden. Her brothers were in the underground – printing illegal newspapers, conducting sabotage, and the like. Danish troups are serving in Afghanistan and have in Iraq; I am proud of their efforts and to be half-Danish.
Comment by Pete — January 5, 2009 @ 9:00 am |
Differences? Well, the NAZI’s had snappy uniforms and really good marching bands. And I’m guessing their personal hygiene was also much better. Muhammed and Hitler were doing the work of their god, Satan.
Comment by michael — January 5, 2009 @ 9:18 am |
While Mr. Rosenbaum makes the effort of quoting Hadees or Saying of Mohammad,( Which are by the way almost all disputed and cannot be confirmed)he does injustice to those hundreds of years of Jewish and Muslim life that they lived in the toughest times of Jewish persecution in Europe before Nazis.
Mohammad honored Jewish families of Madina and unlike your perception that we Muslims are raised with hatred of Jews, we are the only people who pay complete respect to all religions. I agree with you that there are disrespectful and inhuman elements among our ranks and we are worse off because of them but do not discourage those who are not looking at this issue from tainted vision.I always wonder why Islam becomes problematic despite sharing most of the ideas of Judaism and I think the reason is that we do have the worst P.R!
May we all have the courage and wisdom to live in peace and never let go of our fine human values that make life worth living.
Comment by asma mahmood — January 5, 2009 @ 9:35 am |
Well, your article explains a lot I haven’t been able to grasp. I don’t understand liberals, for the most part, it always seems to me they are standing on their heads and see a world I don’t see. Personally, if someone was sworn to hate and kill me I would want to harm them, first. I’d at least keep my attention on them and a gun in my hand.
Self-defense is always the best and first choice.
Mr. Berman-Gorvine – Mr. Rosenbaum isn’t calling people liberals, they call themselves, liberals, he just isn’t arguing with them. A liberal is a person who votes Liberal-Democratic.
I believe that Israel must go to war and destroy Hamas. The Muslims are terrifying an entire world. They need to be taught a lesson. Perhaps we can make the 21st century a more peaceful century, but, first, we must show the Muslim extremists we will not be threatened or murdered for the sake of their ignorant, war-loving religion.
Israel has my complete support. It always will.
Why does evil always pick first on the Jews?
I can’t wait for the first pictures of crucified men and women to appear on the Internet, while I pity and grieve for the victims, I wonder.. how are liberals going to react? How will the press react to an obvious act of terror and torture in THIS century? What excuses will they make? Will they say they can’t take pictures because they are too graphic? The pictures will appear, anyway. Crucification is a horrific way to die; part torture, part execution.
What excuse will liberals come up with for their beloved Hamas and Islamic fundamentalists?
Comment by Kathleen Mary — January 5, 2009 @ 9:50 am |
#1
Hamas Has a death camp, it is called Israel. They just haven’t been able to get good enough to kill millions, YET.
Comment by Mudpie — January 5, 2009 @ 9:54 am |
[…] would actually help if you realised that: 1. Hamas was elected to run Gaza 2. Hamas clearly states they hate all Jews and want to see Israel wiped of their face of the earth…its in their charter. 3. Hamas are […]
Pingback by Dodgeblogium » A note to celebs and their apologists… — January 5, 2009 @ 9:59 am |
Great piece, quite right too and you got to love that headline. I can think of a few people whose heads might explode reading it.
Comment by Andrew Ian Dodge — January 5, 2009 @ 10:03 am |
JFM is correct. The reason why the Nazis eventually used gaschambers are:
1) money (bullets were expensive, not to mention they were needed for fighting the “Soviet hordes of subhumans”)
2) efficiency (they had to kill a lot of people in a short time)
3) I remember a document that claimed that shooting so many people had a bad effect on the SS soldiers’ morale
Everything was calculated through. It was an icecold machinery.
@Rekha brown: Israel is the best student of Hitler? If Israel is really doing genocide there… honestly? Then they are extremely bad at it. Decades have passed and the number of “Palestinians” hasn’t really decreased, has it? If that’s genocide, then it’s the worst planned and done ever.
If the Israelis wanted to do a little genocide with the “Palestinians” (whatever that is anyway, cause there was never a palestinian state, never; and, historically, “Palestinians” should rather refer to muslims, Christians and Jews who live in “Palestine”), then they could have done it ages ago.
BTW… Hitler’s “Mein Kampf” is a topseller in Turkey and many other islamic states. Hitler admired islam, the SS was running a mullah school… Hmm… Coincidence? I think not.
Sad thing is, there was a demonstration in Germany just the other day. Hamas sympathisers and German communists marched through Munich. One of the banners said “Go to hell Israel”. Munich. That’s the city of the “movement”. Hitler’s movement.
In the Netherlands, a Dutch socialist called for an “intifada against Israel” and people cheered “Hamas, Hamas, Jews into the gas”.
Europe 2009.
On September 20th, 2008, the leftist mob in the German city of Cologne beat up several Jews because they were Jews and some of them were also taking part in the anti-islamisation congress (which was attacked by the leftist mob as well).
Police watched in all those cases and did nothing.
In 2007 and 2008 a silent vigil in Brussels, for the victims of 9/11, was banned by the mayor of Brussels. His reason in 2007 was: it may anger/offend the muslims in the town. Then Belgian police moved against peaceful, unarmed protestors and used full force to arrest them.
Say one single word against islam in Europe and you can be glad if the leftist mob “only” beats you up.
Say one good word about Israel in Europe, and you can be glad if the leftist mob “only” beats you up.
Comment by Takekaze — January 5, 2009 @ 10:13 am |
Great article-I wish it’d have a much wider readership. It’d be nice if the MSM could come to the defense of western civilization and expose this threat we’re facing from muslims. We’re in WW3 against Islam (today’s Nazism) and yet so few people realize it. Hopefully we’ll wake up before its too late.
Comment by bill — January 5, 2009 @ 10:17 am |
And the Islamist propaganda machine is dumping millions of dollars into western media, colleges, politics and culture to help undermine it and take it over. They have had more time to do this than the Nazis and are having much more success.
Comment by DL13 — January 5, 2009 @ 10:18 am |
[…] you might guess, the distinctions do not flatter Hamas. The most disgraceful one, in my opinion: –FDR called for the “unconditional surrender” of […]
Pingback by Cold Fury » The difference between Hamas and Hitler — January 5, 2009 @ 10:21 am |
Islam generally is an ideology rooted in the wholesale murder of the “other” including its own adherents whose doctrine differs from the mainstream.This is obvious not only in the middle east where it interacts with Jews and Christians but also on the Indian sub Continent and South East Asia where it enters into violent confrontation with Hindus and Buddhists.A thoroughly toxic and anachronistic creed that represents the largest, single obstacle to human peace and progress that we now must deal with.The struggle of the Jews and the Hindus is the struggle of humanity
Comment by Diana — January 5, 2009 @ 10:22 am |
“While I understand your points and think Hamas is an evil organization, they will never approach the level of the Nazi’s until they open death camps and kill millions.”
Hamas doesn’t have enough infrastructure to pull off the task. Let’s keep it that way.
Comment by Alan K. Henderson — January 5, 2009 @ 10:22 am |
To Martin Berman-Gorvine: Maybe Bobby Kennedy and other liberals have supported Israel, but I believe that the broad characterization is still correct. Liberals that I know think that Israel must be confronted, and that we need more diplomatic talks, despite the fact that they never go anywhere productive. These people (Hamas) want to destroy Israel and its people, and until we all reach that conclusion and act accordingly, their future is in jeopardy.
Comment by Steve — January 5, 2009 @ 10:35 am |
[…] DON’T CALL THEM “BARBARIANS,” because that would be rude. Comparing Hamas to the Nazis. “The Hamas founding covenant explicitly calls for the extermination of all Jews. Hitler never […]
Pingback by Instapundit » Blog Archive » BUT DON’T CALL THEM “BARBARIANS,” because that would be rude. Comparing Hamas to the Nazis. “The H… — January 5, 2009 @ 11:28 am |
And all the anti-Zionist propaganda around the world is just like in 1938, only a thousand times more powerful thanks to today’s technology.
Comment by m — January 5, 2009 @ 11:34 am |
Uh, this is off-base.
Say what you like about hamas, and its extreme jew-hatred, but hitler actually had the support, backing, and industrial might to make it a reality. Hamas resorts to flinging rockets.
Hitler forged alliances and was a danger to the entire world at the time, whereas hamas has done little or nothing outside of the middle east, and tbh, can only do anything mostly because Isreal was created right in its midst.
Millions have lost their lives in World war 2, and i don’t think we can say the same about the israeli-palestinian conflict.
I don’t justify hamas in one bit, or mean to mitigate what they do, but the threat they pose is dependent not so much on ideology, but on the military and social power they hold. To overstate their threat is to play into their hands, and this comparison is a huge overstatement, because its all talk.
The nazis will always be more extreme because they had the power and will to actually do genocide on a huge scale. Hamas may talk louder, but thankfully they cannot pull off even a fraction of that carnage, and could easily be defanged, be it militarily or by removing the impetus to support them, by creating a palestinian state.
Comment by Dave D — January 5, 2009 @ 11:36 am |
The only difference here is that Hamas lacks the military might of the Nazis. That is the only thing holding them back from doing this. If their roles were reversed with the IDF, it would be a moot point.
Comment by Mike T — January 5, 2009 @ 11:40 am |
No, no, Ron, you aren’t being properly multicultural. Hamas really just wants peace, prosperity, a chance for its people tohave a decent life. Besides, it’s hard to pick sides since the Palestinians are opporessed and hopeless–ask J Street if you don’t believe me.
They really want peace, despite everything, absolutely everything, they say and do.
There! Now doesn’t it make the problem easier to solve?
Comment by Alex Bensky — January 5, 2009 @ 11:49 am |
The apt comparison is between Zionism and Nazism. Both are racist, both demand lebensraum for the select at the expense of the indigenous.
In reality, Israel was founded in terrorism, ethnic cleansing and land theft. Those are still characteristics of the Israeli state. Hamas and Hezbollah are freedom fighters against an illegitimate, oppressive, occupying power: a power that does not share the values of the rest of humanity.
If the Palestinian people had all the weaponry that the U.S. provides its terrorist client state, Israeli aggression would be properly punished and would cease.
Comment by Mike — January 5, 2009 @ 12:00 pm |
Intellectual Redneck says: “While I understand your points and think Hamas is an evil organization, they will never approach the level of the Nazi’s until they open death camps and kill millions.”
I don’t want to wait until they’re strong enough to do that. They clearly would if they could. Let’s eliminate them before they can.
Comment by KenB — January 5, 2009 @ 12:05 pm |
There is another difference. The Nazis wore uniforms when they fought and did not hide behind their own women and children. I suspect they would have thought that, well, unmanly.
Comment by Michael Reinhard — January 5, 2009 @ 12:06 pm |
Well, as far as I know Hitler had something in mind that was called the Endlösung (final solution) which implied extermination of all Jews.
Europe underwent a cultural amputation when all the German Jews were killed. We replaced these smart and diligient people by hordes of muslims who are NEVER loyal to any democratic constitution…
Now, Alex Bensky, I was properly multicultural by marrying a muslim, which cured me of all such delusions…
I am so afraid that there will NEVER be peace for Israel living among these barbarians who obviously like being at loogerheads with everything non-muslim…
Comment by cassandra — January 5, 2009 @ 12:10 pm |
There may be a direct ideological connection of sorts between the Nazis and the Hamas (via the Muslim Brotherhood). See writings of Dr. Kunzel at http://www.matthiaskuentzel.de/contents/hitlers-legacy-islamic-antisemitism-and-the-impact-of-the-muslim-brotherhood
Comment by mg — January 5, 2009 @ 12:23 pm |
Agree with JFM, generally. I’ve said since 9/11 we’re dealing with a far more rabid, insane hatred than the Nazis, only we’re lucky the Arab world is generally too stupid and inefficient where the Nazis had the ability to be quite efficient and organized. Yes, I realize the Nazis never pulled off a 9/11 over here, but nevertheless, I believe your average Arab/Muslim, for a long time, hates Jews far more deeply and sincerely than your average German in the 1930s and 40s.
Comment by Brad — January 5, 2009 @ 12:26 pm |
Earth to far left Colleges ,Pacifist , The Media , Liberals , Socialist , Europeans and Progressive Jews ..
Most Moslems and Arab’s World Wide would send Cheering Millions to see all Jews , White Christians gassed or put into Hitler’s ovens .
Of course Pacifist , Atheist and none Moslems would be next put in the Ovens and Gas chambers .
Blacks would return to Slavery since Moslems had more Black Slaves that all of the world History put together numbering over 50 Million in 1700 years . Africa its self rates Second .
Yet Moslems are not called Slave owners and Blacks have Moslem names …. Go Figure .
Wake up World !
Comment by ReConUSMC — January 5, 2009 @ 12:47 pm |
Of course it is evil for Hamas to send rockets into Israel. But the great democracies of the world seem insular in trying defend against this universal problem of fundamentalism. The fundamentalist rhetoric is not solely focused on eradicating Jews, but also Hindus in India (so-called Kafirs), Americans, and other non-believers. Note that these assaults are often coupled (9/11/01 World Trade Towers and 12/13/01 attack on Indian Parliament; Mumbai attack less than 2 months ago and Hamas rockets just before the cease-fire lapses), perhaps intentionally because and around the time of regime changes in the US.
Hamas is of course focused on solely doing harm to Israel, but aren’t there parent organizations that drive this hatred? Similarly Lakshaiya e-Taiba is determined to destroy India, but from where do they derive support (Note the aptly named United Jihad Council in Kashmir)? Why, for instance, does the Arab League refuse to allow member nations to grant citizenship to lawful, decent Palestinians “to avoid dissolution of their identity and protect their right to return to their homeland”?
Who is the MORE evil, Hamas or Hitler? I’m not sure how relevant the question is – Hamas is dedicated to killing Jews and hides behind innocent Palestinians. Hitler was similarly dedicated. Hatred in all forms and to all degrees is evil. Unfortunately, killing an evil man today doesn’t prevent his brother from attacking you tomorrow, and fundamentalists have proven they have access to a limitless supply of ‘martyrs’ of hatred.
Comment by Ashwin — January 5, 2009 @ 12:56 pm |
Need we forget
Israeli hard-liners have warned for many years that any territory Israel vacates will be used to attack it. Now they can point to the Hamas missile that slammed into a bus stop in this port city Monday, killing a 39-year-old woman. It was fired from the Gaza Strip, which Israel gave up in 2005 and is now ruled by Hamas militants who reject the existence of the Jewish state. … Israelis who never thought they would be living under rocket fire prepared bomb shelters. Newspapers and TV stations displayed color-coded maps informing Israelis that they had 15, 30 or 45 seconds to reach cover after a warning siren goes off. In Ashdod malls, directions to the nearest shelters were posted.
Of course there have beeen 231 Suicide Bombing in Tiny Israel by Hamas’ since Israel gave the Gaza to them ”Peacefully “two years ago ……. Bombing School Bus’s , Pizza shops and grocery stores with no warning at all .. ‘It Tells all Peaceful Israel to take the Land back and end Hamas’ terrorism on their Citizens . Hamas’ is simply in the Kill all Jews possible business .
If my Neighbor was throwing rocks at my Home from Land I had given him as a Gift ….. I would not call the UN , local Police or Obama to stop him …….I would whip his Ass and he would lack the Arm power to through anymore Rocksat my house ….. Believe me …since a man , nation or Govt. is no better than their own ”Word ” or Honor .
Comment by ReConUSMC — January 5, 2009 @ 1:13 pm |
“Hamas . . . will never approach the level of the Nazi’s until they open death camps and kill millions.”
And Europe would again sit by and provide the opportunity.
Comment by Ming the Merciless Siamese Cam — January 5, 2009 @ 2:08 pm |
Mike:
You are a coward. Unlike the real Nazis who took pride in their accomplishments you rely on others to do the dirty work while you play with words so you can posture about your moral superiority.
What makes a Nazi different from other Progressives is anti-Semitism, the irrational hatred of Jews, not some clever turn of the phrase. You and all anti-Semites are Nazis.
Comment by jerryofva — January 5, 2009 @ 2:13 pm |
Cassandra
Goebbels said: “Our biggest problem is that every one of the eighty million Germans has his good Jew”. And in fact I know
of a pre-1933 member of the Nazi party and major of town who saved Jews.
About Hitler, he ended ordering the Final Solution but when? The Wansee conference is in 1942, ie after the first defeats and frustrations exasperated him. I am not very well versed but I think there were no mass killings of Jews before the invasion of Soviet Union (perhaps because he persuaded himeself that the British, he admired, persevered in the fight only due to the influence of the Jews), that it was only after nearly six years in power that the ordered the Christal Nacht. That initially it was mere discriminations and some Jews were exempted (“We decide, who is Jew and who isn’t” Goebbels to a Jewish musician). That in 1933, the Nazi authorities, because they wanted to appear respectable and able to keep initially protected the Jews against agressions. Also, when his mother died he wrote and cortaous and war letter thanking her Jewish doctor (don’t remember if it was before or after WWI).
The above hints that, he didn’t think of the Final Solution, at the time he wrote Main Kampf, or even in 1933, but much later, after the surprise (for him) of France and Great Britain declaring war, British refusal to surrender, first defeats, war with United States (he believed were in Jewish hands), made him paranoid about Jewish plots.
Note also that in 1943 (ie after the Wansee conference) a group of Berlinese woman, staged a demonstration demanding the realease of their Jewish husbands and instead of machine gunning them) the authorities acceeded.
Comment by JFM — January 5, 2009 @ 2:22 pm |
The problem is that Palestinian-ism (a made-up concept for a made-up country) is becoming increasingly mainstream. Covert (and increasingly overt) antisemitism is becoming commonplace. The Palestinian headscarf is becoming a fashion accessory. Newsweek has a story on how Obama “need to get tough with Israel.” The other day, during a pro-Palestinian demonstration in Ft. Lauderdale (Ft. Lauderdale!) a Palestinan woman was yelling at the Jewish counter demonstrators “Send the Jews to the ovens.” Now, tell me again how wa are supposed to get to a two-state solutioon. Tell me again how any Palestiian government is going to make peace when the people want annihilation. Over-looked in all this is the fact that Jew-hatred is woven into the warp and woof of Islam and has been since the Kaybar Jews want under the knife. That famous Hadith is all you need to know.
Comment by Joseph McNulty — January 5, 2009 @ 2:39 pm |
This is one of those arguments that you can have, back and forth and across time, without conclusive result. The Nazis are often held up as the benchmark of cruelty and genocide in the Second World War, but in terms of actual brutality, the Japanese were much worse. Whereas the Germans used the death camps to slaughter millions (though it’s developed relatively recently that they also shot a lot more Jews to death than anyone thought at first), the Japanese tended to do their killing in a more personal, intimate fashion. During the Rape of Nanking they killed about 100,000 Chinese civilians. Apologists (believe it or not there are more than a few of them in Japan these days) argue that the majority of these were adult males who were/might have been guerrillas. Anyway, rather than using gas chambers, firing squads, and the like, the Japanese utilized more “fun” methods: bayonet practice, samurai sword beheading contests, and the like. They also did various things to objectify the bodies afterwords. Iris Chang, in her book on the incident, reproduced photos taken by Japanese soldiers showing dead women with things inserted in their vagina, and in one case a man’s head, set on a fence post, with a cigarette in his mouth. Cruelty on this level isn’t even generally reached by Hamas.
Thing is, Japanese war crimes are generally thought to have been dwarfed by those of the Germans. This, I believe, is for several reasons. One is that the Japanese didn’t single out a particular group: they were pretty much equally brutal and vicious to everyone. Another is that while the Germans were not as individually cruel, they *were* very efficient in their attempts to exterminate the Jews. The Japanese, by comparison, never intended to exterminate the Chinese or any of the other groups they brutalized: instead their intention was to terrorize the civilian population of China into happy slavery to their Japanese masters.
Where does all of this take us? Comparing Hamas to either of these other groups is rather futile. Hamas has killed probably thousands of people, I would expect (I haven’t done any real research, but it’s clear they’re not very good at killing large numbers of those they hate), but in terms of efficiency, they’re not in the same league as the Nazis, and in their artistic devotion to the craft of cruelty, they’re no match for the Japanese. Comparing them to either group is rather like comparing Bill Ayers to Stalin or Hitler. Ayers (according to that FBI informant we’ve all read about) mused about having to kill as many as 25 million people if he became dictator-for-life of the United States. Stalin and Hitler actually made the effort, and got a good start on the goal, whether they actually talked about it in numbers like this. One wants to do something, the other actually did it, partially or in full. Let’s hope Hamas remains largely in the Ayers mold, a repugnant and disgusting person who was mostly an incompetent wannabe.
Comment by DavidN — January 5, 2009 @ 2:39 pm |
FAR LEFT LOVES HAMAS TERRORISTS:
Especially since the Nazis were not far left.
http://greensrealworld.blogspot.com/2009/01/far-left-loves-hamas-terrorists.html
Comment by The Historian — January 5, 2009 @ 2:41 pm |
33 MIKE …? …..are you still on the Egg Nog ? Or are you so Liberal anti Jew and American your simply stupid .
You must have been taken Victimhood class’s rather than world History obviously .
Murdering Slave holding Moslems of Black Africans terrorized the World from Africa , China , India Turkey , Iraq , Iran , Russia to England , Germany and Spain for over 1700 years and Murdered Millions upon Millions under Sadden type Dictators . Allah was hardly a Mother Teresa or Gandhi .
Israel controls a state the size of Delaware … 1.7 % of the entire middle east you Moron and the only Democracy .
One suspects You need to Live in Iran , under Saddam , The Telibone or under Al Quada and Bin Laden .
That would sober you misconceptions up once and for all …… In your case maybe not ?
Comment by ReConUSMC — January 5, 2009 @ 2:50 pm |
[…] a fanatical hate group. RonRosenbaum.com Some Differences Between Hamas and the Nazi Party It is ironic that much of the socialistic media in Europe presents Hamas as a group merely […]
Pingback by Hamas a fanatical hate group. - LDS Mormon Forums — January 5, 2009 @ 2:52 pm |
Recall please the close ties between Hitler and the grand Mufti of Jerusalem- Arafat’s uncle- and the proxy war Germany fought against the allies using Palestinians in the British mandate. European Muslims-Bosnians-enlisted in the SS and there were grand plans for the extension of the final solution into the middle east. The Nazi party and Hamas are not just similar, they are kissing cousins.
Comment by barb — January 5, 2009 @ 2:57 pm |
Thanks to Pajamas Media for their ongoing, outstanding coverage of this issue. There are precious few places where one can find such coverage.
As for this piece, while I appreciate the pro-Israeli position, I see no reason why the need for comparison between Hamas and Hitler unless the thought is that it might drive the point home to some who otherwise aren’t getting it. If so, I doubt it would be effective, but one can hope. Otherwise, it seems an intellectual excercise and strikes me as unnecessary and somewhat ivory tower. I wonder if those Israeli’s who are living with this nightmare every day would be so focused on who was/is worse, Hamas or Hitler. Somehow, I doubt it would seem relevent.
To those who have found this piece a point of departure for an attemtp at a supposidly clever remark (such as the Nazi’s dressing better), while your sympathies might lie with Israel, the subject matter is hardly fitting for humor of any kind, in my view. While we’re sitting here typing, people are suffering and dying and the world continues to indulge in the misguided thinking that the Jews are the evildoers.
Comment by Anna — January 5, 2009 @ 3:16 pm |
Even while granting an allowance for rhetorical excess, certain comparisons go too far.
Rosenbaum’s title is one of them.
Comment by C.S. Maxwell — January 5, 2009 @ 3:30 pm |
Mike (#33) is like many liberals. They never studied real history so they make up their own.
Comment by Saltherring — January 5, 2009 @ 4:04 pm |
Get bent, Rosenbaum, you loser. Your conservative philosophy is bankrupted, along with the rest of the Country.
I think we’ve all had just about enough of your questioning other people’s patriotism, equating people who think you’re a ranking idiot as Nazis, and pretending as though your ‘vision’ of foreign policy is anything other than a complete and total abject failure.
Comment by broadsword — January 5, 2009 @ 4:39 pm |
Comparing Hamas to either of these other groups is rather futile. Hamas has killed probably thousands of people
So the reason they are not as bad is that they have no killed enough Jews?
Is this reasoning warped or is it just me? So what will it take a nice dirty bomb killing hundreds of thousands? Or does it have to be a proper nuke killing millions?
To me its very simple…both the Nazis and Hamas have an expressed aim to wipe the Jews off the face of the earth.
Comment by Andrew Ian Dodge — January 5, 2009 @ 4:54 pm |
And besides, Hitler loved dogs, and Hamas considers them unclean. I’m failing to see any redeeming quality in these … whatever they are.
Comment by Pee Wee Herman, Community Organizer — January 5, 2009 @ 4:58 pm |
If you want to have some fun (and if PJM allows it) repost this somewhere where there’s a large clueless audience that really needs to see it, like Daily Kos.
Comment by Nice article — January 5, 2009 @ 5:26 pm |
Hamas’ political leaders have often said, “We love death as you love life.”
Can’t disagree with that.
So how about we live and Hamas dies?
Sounds like a win-win, we both get what we want.
Comment by Brian — January 5, 2009 @ 5:57 pm |
47. C.S. Maxwell:
Even while granting an allowance for rhetorical excess, certain comparisons go too far.
Rosenbaum’s title is one of them.
__________________________________________
Hitler had no Suicide Bombers lefty or killed in the name of any Gods
In 1944 Germany had a test Pilot that wanted to test the very dangerous Rocket Plane(that could mean his sure death ) but it never flew .
According to Military History Hitler prison camps treated our troops pretty good and allowed games and red cross drop offs and letters .
The Moslem treat our Prisons terrible ….. all of them…… that is the ones that don’t get beheaded , skinned or burned alive . No Moslem nation or group is a member of the Geneva convention but ISRAEL is.
There have been 5, 671 Moslem Suicide Bombing in 24 Countries Lefty …14 moslem countries and 10 none Moslem countries …. ….. is that excess rhetoric Lefty ?
Comment by ReConUSMC — January 5, 2009 @ 6:37 pm |
Guys, again. Please watch this 3 minute video on the “future generation” of Jihadists and let’s talk after that. Children of Hamas – http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTGbP55HGi8
Comment by IsraelsFriend — January 5, 2009 @ 6:48 pm |
It isn’t just Hamas. See here for some objective studies of what children are being taught in other Arab countries: http://www.impact-se.org/research/reports.html
Saudi Arabia (for instance) teaches school children that the fraudulent ant-Semitic text “Protocols of the Elders of Zion”, which Hitler used to justify the Holocaust, is authentic. A television series that aired in Egypt was based on the book. The Palestinians are just a convenient source of child martyrs for the Arab world to use to fight a war against Jews that they couldn’t win with tanks and airplanes. And when you fight back against child martyrs, you end up looking like the bad guy – at least with a media willing to ignore all context.
Comment by Bill V. — January 5, 2009 @ 7:21 pm |
In terms of ideological inconsistency with western civilization, Nazi and Hamas ambitions are identical, and their value on planet Earth is consequently the same. In terms of the ability to carry out their intentions, the Nazis were unquestionably much more powerful. But that doesn’t get Hamas off the hook. Regardless of whether they are “terrorists” or “freedom fighters”, their lack of logistical capability to ever accomplish their stated ends means they must accept submission (which doctrine-wise they should be totally used to), or else the civilized and strong nations are obliged to eradicate them for the good of jews and arabs alike.
What is very amusing is the folks on this thread who don’t understand why a Jewish person would make the comparison. Clearly it may sound alarmist to non-jews to compare Hamas to Nazis. Those points are all valid. Then again, it’s kind of a matter of perspective, isn’t it? When was the last time Islamic radicals threatened all followers of Martin Luther? Or L. Ron Fricking Hubbard? Or Mother Earth?
I’m very much unimpressed with the logic of those who sympathize with Hamas or seek to counter the alarmism raised by Jews because they are bothered by the logical inconsistencies (I had thought alarmism was quite fashionable in liberal circles, by the way). Seriously, with gems like “[Hamas] could easily be defanged, be it militarily or by removing the impetus to support them, by creating a palestinian state” and “If the Palestinian people had all the weaponry that the U.S. provides its terrorist client state, Israeli aggression would be properly punished and would cease.” — that stuff is just plain comedy. Grow up. Those two statements are absurd and childish to boot, and they expose Dave and Mike as activists. Israel is the strong, Hamas and their ilk are the weak. The only reason Hamas continues to yap is because the Israelis have exercised restraint and not given them more pressing concerns, which they really ought do. That’s right, I said it. Israeli restraint. You honestly think that Israel is not being judicious about the force it applies? How many 1967s ought they inflict before arab radicals are forced to acknowledge that while they don’t think Israel has a “right to exist” — as if (preposterously) there is such a thing — if those same arabs are insufficiently end-of-times to actually value their personal life, it’s not really up to them after all?
Comment by LennyB — January 5, 2009 @ 7:29 pm |
Nazis had the scientific rationale of improving their Teutonic race by getting rid of “vermin”. It was a “gardening” experiment devoid of religious underpinnings, so religion was suppressed.
The far more venal threat of Hamas is you have the same desire to exterminate Jews, sanctified by their religion. It’s then exacerbated by one of the highest birth rates in the world, to a people addicted to global welfare and victimhood, who are skilled in nothing but devious manipulation. The polygamy and cousin-marrying endemic to this society promotes violence. Women must be subdued and young men must be culled.
Comment by Nancy Albert — January 5, 2009 @ 7:47 pm |
[…] RonRosenbaum.com » Some Differences Between Hamas and the Nazi Party (tags: terrorism Israel) […]
Pingback by links for 2009-01-05 « Brain Music –Gadgets, Neuroscience, Music, Social Media, Health 2.0 & More — January 5, 2009 @ 8:03 pm |
Dave D,
There is a Palestinian state. It’s called Jordan.
Comment by P. Ami — January 5, 2009 @ 8:29 pm |
Hitler said, in Mein Kampf, once you use the word religion it becomes “Sacred” and unassailable. Or it’s like your history book forgets the invasions of the Muslims that defeated France, right before the crusades…
or that in the 1500’s turkey almost took Vienna… It’s because liberals refuse to have any book written by a dead white guy read at public schools. Way too go! War is about culture and death by nature…
Comment by joe — January 5, 2009 @ 9:00 pm |
[…] Posted by Fiannan RonRosenbaum.com Some Differences Between Hamas and the Nazi Party It is ironic that much of the socialistic media in Europe presents Hamas as a group merely […]
Pingback by Hamas a fanatical hate group. - Page 2 - LDS Mormon Forums — January 5, 2009 @ 10:08 pm |
[…] Some Differences Between Hamas and the Nazi Party […]
Pingback by “Some Differences Between Hammas and the Nazi Party” by Ron Rosenbaum [4 January 2009] « Father Brian Van Hove’s Blog — January 5, 2009 @ 10:22 pm |
Why Israel doesn’t do the world-and especially Islam- a favor by disappearing from the surface of the earth and going six feet under so that Islamists can go back to their current business of blowing each other up ? Certainly they have much more to attend to than with this shabby piece of real estate that doesn’t even have oil and with such a puny population.
You are wasting these g00d people’s time,Israel.
Scram then, so that the world can
at last achieve Peace of the Tomb.
Comment by misanthropicmaniac — January 5, 2009 @ 10:35 pm |
As a matter of fact… the Luftwaffe did fly some 20 suicide missions using Bf109s carrying explosives against bridges on the Eastern Front during the last month of WW II. Other suicide missions were ad-hoc affairs, this special attack squadron was the only one organised and trained as such.
There is another similarity in the Hamas Charter that I’m surprised hasn’t been mentioned: the “Heute Europa, Morgen die Welt” syndrome. Today Europe, tomorrow the world.
The Hamas charter makes it quite clear that Palestine is only the first step, and that the intermediate aim is the regaining of all lands taken during the Muslim Conquest(s). All such lands are decreed by Allah to be theirs. This includes Spain, all of France south of Paris, Sicily, all of Europe east of Vienna, plus the whole of India. They state that war will not cease until those lands are regained.
The long-term aim is to have the whole world in the Ummah, but only the lands mentioned above are to be part of the Caliphate: the rest can be muslim-ruled tributaries.
Comment by Zoe Brain — January 6, 2009 @ 12:24 am |
Oh … another difference between Hamas and the Nazis. The people who voted the Nazis into power lost 1.5 million civilians in the resulting war, but they conceded defeat and didn’t cry and wail like innocent victims.
Comment by Bill V. — January 6, 2009 @ 1:46 am |
[…] Artikel, der für deutsche Leser besonders interessant sein dürfte. Ron Rosenbaum weist auf die Unterschiede zwischen Hitler und der Hamas hin. Er kommt zu dem Ergebnis, daß die Hamas noch destruktiver ist als Hitler.
Pingback by Zwei Artikel « Letters from Rungholt — January 6, 2009 @ 1:52 am |
Even while granting an allowance for rhetorical excess, certain comparisons go too far. Rosenbaum’s title is one of them.
Tell me where it goes too far? Rosenbaum hasn’t limited himself to write a catchy title but supports his thesis with good arguments. You don’t.
Comment by JFM — January 6, 2009 @ 2:51 am |
[…] Shorter Ron Rosenbaum: “Israel’s government is always right, and anyone who says otherwise is a Hitler-fellating anti-Semite!” […]
Pingback by JABbering Stooge :: Glennocidal Tendencies: Israel vs. Palestine Edition :: January :: 2009 — January 6, 2009 @ 3:30 am |
[…] Noch eine Fremde Feder 6 Januar 2009 at 11:35 | In Fremde Federn | Ron Rosenberg.com […]
Pingback by Noch eine Fremde Feder « grenzgaenge — January 6, 2009 @ 3:35 am |
I just have ask what is acceptable? O.K. Israel is there NOW. They have with the Balfour Agreement conquered Palestine. With that said does that give them moral authority to do what they do? I think not. If my house was bulldozed and my Grandparents refused to leave the house they built and had paper work for and were murdered. I would also fight to the death. What is sad is the innocent suffer. Hamas and every Palestinian has every right to try to force Israel from Palestine. I am embarrassed by my countrys support for Israel. Yes born and reared in the U.S. How many of you would support American Indian land seizure today? Or Apartheid, Darfur ethnic cleansing, or the holocaust? That is what has been going on for years in Israel.
Those Hamas rockets are glorified fireworks. I completely understand why the Arabs call us the Great Satan and want Israel destroyed. I don’t agree but I truly understand. Israel is a oppressive occupier. And I want none of my tax dollars going there way. Israel gets the equivalent to $10,000.00 a year per citizen in U.S. aid.
You can’t address todays issues without facing what Israel really is. A occupying force that hordes all resources and keeps the original people in permanent refugee status.
Religion is a non factor in my view.
Comment by Another View — January 6, 2009 @ 6:59 am |
“Say what you like about the tenets of National Socialism, at least it was an ethos.”
–Walter Sobchak
Comment by Shef Rogers — January 6, 2009 @ 7:47 am |
The big differences between Nazis and Hammas are: spelling and efficiency. Hamas lacks the skills needed to accomplish their goals, but those goals are not significantly different from Hitler’s goals.
Comment by Mathdoc — January 6, 2009 @ 8:48 am |
This is the most vile piece of writing I have seen on the subject of the Gaza war, and among the most vile I have ever read, anywhere, anytime. I may have read something worse than this at some point, but if I did, the memory escapes me right now.
I won’t say that you should be ashamed of yourself, because if you were capable of that, obviously you would not have written this trash to begin with.
My paternal grandmother died at Sobibor. Most of my father’s extended family was murdered by the Nazis. My mother fled Europe with her father and brother just before the doors closed completely.
Did anyone in your family die in the Holocaust? Did you grow up in a family of Holocaust survivors? Please tell me you didn’t, because that will make me feel marginally better that a Jewish person has written this collection of lies, distortions, and sheer fabrications, presenting it as truth, with no links or references to back up any of your assertions. None. But then how could you? There are no reputable sources in existence that you could call on to support your claim that the Nazis were a lesser evil than Hamas.
I am ashamed that you are Jewish (which I assume, from your name, you are). You are a disgrace to the Jewish people. You are a shonde to the goyim. It’s disgraceful, profoundly distressing, depressing, and discouraging that a fellow Jew could even entertain these beliefs for one second, much less publish them.
Comment by Kathy — January 6, 2009 @ 9:49 am |
I just have ask what is acceptable? O.K. Israel is there NOW. They have with the Balfour Agreement conquered Palestine.
?ope. They didn’t conquer. They bought lands from the Turks and from Arab landowners at at time where neither Arabs, or Jews had their own state in the region (it was part of Turkey)
With that said does that give them moral authority to do what they do?
I agree they have no moral authority to allow their populations being fired upon fifty times a day. They have no moral authority to allow unlawful combatants violate again and again laws of warfare thus undermining the essential dispositions of the Genva Convetions aimed at depriving war crime of benefitting the criminal: for your info if you hide behind civilians and shoot, the enemy is allowed to shoot back and in addition to sentence you to death if you are taken alive. A lot less civilans would be hurt if Israel and other countries had enforced the law of warfare from day 1.
. If my house was bulldozed and my Grandparents refused to leave the house they built and had paper work for and were murdered. I would also fight to the death.
And if sopmene had been firing rockets for years upon my children I would be a LOT less nice than the Israelis, who by the way give a lot more than fifteeen seconds to clear the house. Isreali children don’t have this luck.
What is sad is the innocent suffer. Hamas and every Palestinian has every right to try to force Israel from Palestine.
The Arabic word for Palestine is, depending on the country of the speaker, Filasteen or Falasteen. That is the land of Filstines. That is Gaza, Istrael is not interested upon as long as they don’t fire at its citizens from it.
I am embarrassed by my countrys support for Israel. Yes born and reared in the U.S. How many of you would support American Indian land seizure today?
I am embarassed by your support of would-be genociders.
Those Hamas rockets are glorified fireworks
I have seen what 250g of explosive can do and the payload of those glorified is 10 kg (40 times that). Also you would mind if I fire a few upon your house or still better on you and youtr children? Or in the general area of the maternity in your city?
I completely understand why the Arabs call us the Great Satan and want Israel destroyed.
I too. I understand that Arabs consider themselves Herrenvolsk with the right to step upon everyone else, others not being allowed to retaliate, others paying their bills and in addition claiming tehy are the victimls.
Let’s talk about the Kurds they gassed and expelled from their lands, let’s talk about the Sahraouis expelled from their lands by the Moroccans, about the Berbers opressed in Algeria, about the mass murders, enslaving and rapes in Sudan, about the Copts, about the Sephardis who had been living in the zone since well before Christ (ie centuries befotre the arrrival of the first Arab) expelled or murdered in 1948. But the Arabs have no qualms baout any of this. Also guess who puts bread on the table the of the Palestians? Their brother Arab countries? The had work of the Palestinans? You must be kidding. It is the european and Americanb tax payer. Palestian main/only economic activity is laking Kasams. Feeding them that is what untermenschen are made for?
You can’t address todays issues without facing what Israel really is. A occupying force that hordes all resources and keeps the original people in permanent refugee status.
Comment by JFM — January 6, 2009 @ 10:20 am |
Great article! Most do not wnat to ehar this. The EU can not even say Hamas are terrorists. Some including Londons ex-mayor Ken Livingstone perpetuate lies and has said Gaza is like the Warsaw Ghetto. What an insult to the victims of the Holocaust and an anti Semitic comment if I ever heard one. Proportinality to some means tit for tat. If Israel launched 7,000 unguided crude missiles and rockets in Gaza it would be a war crime. We will not change opinions but we also will not permit lies to go unchallneged and corrected. Hamas has a choice, stop the attacks and have Peace or war. If they cared about their people they would seek Peace, obviously there is an issue with Hamas and Peace. Thank you for a great article. Much needed ammunition at a time of media bias and lies.
Comment by Budd — January 6, 2009 @ 10:36 am |
Where the Nazis left off in man’s inhumanity to man, the hammer and sickle crowd went further to lower depths,
and where the hammer and sickle crowd left off, the “Sons of Allah” went further.
Comment by David W. Lincoln — January 6, 2009 @ 10:40 am |
Might I suggest a trade-off? If the Zionists began calling rhetorically for the extermination of the Palestinians while their planes stopped killing schoolchildren in U.N. buildings in Gaza, then we would have a level playing field. Of course exterminationist rhetoric is not necessary when 2000 pound bombs suffice.
Comment by Louis Proyect — January 6, 2009 @ 11:01 am |
TROLL ALERT
another view at 86 is copying and pasting the same post all over the blogs about hamas. he is not capable to writing down different post.
I strongly advice moderators, instead of censoring others, to cancel his CROSS posting.
Comment by susan — January 6, 2009 @ 11:20 am |
Thank you.
Comment by Noah — January 6, 2009 @ 11:59 am |
Land for peace never worked. Israel would be justified in reclaiming Gaza and the West Bank. The United States has been a pitiful, helpless giant through years of bogus negotiating, most recently by Condoleeza Rice. Years ago, the USA should have forced the Saudis and the Jordanians to resettle the Palestinians and the Palestinians should have been disarmed by US troops. The reality of Israel us that it was created in the matrix of world anti-Semitism after World War II, that its existence would be guaranteed by the simple exigent of Arab acceptance, that, resource-wise, its land is worthless, and, as Jews worldwide suspect, nonJews have no stake whatsoever in the existence of Israel. Geopolitically, to allow Israel to exist in peace is the equivalent of allowing Rhode Island to exist in peace. Regrettably, only a nuclear exchange remains to transform the idiotic status quo, much as US atom bombs changed shintoism and 9/11 stopped the funding of the IRA from the taverns of New York.
Comment by charlie finch — January 6, 2009 @ 12:13 pm |
[…] Posted by Fiannan RonRosenbaum.com Some Differences Between Hamas and the Nazi Party It is ironic that much of the socialistic media in Europe presents Hamas as a group merely […]
Pingback by Hamas a fanatical hate group. - Page 3 - LDS Mormon Forums — January 6, 2009 @ 1:19 pm |
I am still surprised that the God of Israel has not been able to step into his rightful position and rain down fire from heaven unto the enemies of Israel and destroy them as depicted in the stories of the Old Testament in the bible and the Torah. The saying “we can do nothing without God” has sure changed its meaning after the Old Testament stories has been laid to rest. The reality of the world conflicts today is “God is nothing without human intervention and the firepower their military forces can produce as they subdue their enemies.” The stories of the past continue to spawn the hellish pictures of human suffering throughout the world. The time has come for the young people of this world to take a closer look and ask themselves – are they willing to continue in the mire of their parents and grandparents as they ensure the continuation of such a future for their children and grand-children for generations to come. Indeed the time for change is at hand, the reality of the past, the present and the future is something every generation faces; however, never before in the history of the world has there been an opportunity such as this to make a change in the lives of so many people with such little effort. “Money can provide a good defense, and wisdom can also provide a good defense – the difference between the two, wisdom is often concealed as money take center-stage and proves to be the most important. The end result wisdom brings reason and understanding but money brings results and rewards.” If in fact the God of Israel is so powerful why is it that the people rely more on Pray to their God for their defense, as opposed to fire-power and weapons of destruction that are being used upon their enemies. It sure makes me wonder if in fact their God really exists, and is he as powerful as they ascribe such power.
Comment by Christopher — January 6, 2009 @ 1:38 pm |
[…] Via Glenn Reynolds: Ron Rosenbaum ser på forskellene mellem Hamas og NSDAP med Hitler ved roret her. […]
Pingback by Dagens citat « Econstudentlog — January 6, 2009 @ 1:42 pm |
Nazism and jihad terrorists have always been closely linked; e.g., The Grand Mufti
http://tellthechildrenthetruth.com/gallery/
http://tellthechildrenthetruth.com/saddam_en.html
Comment by Rick — January 6, 2009 @ 3:20 pm |
Oh and by the way: the Germans didn’t employ suicide attacks much, though they did have a few. They had a program in the Luftwaffe, for instance, called “Wilde Sau” or Wild Boars, which involved specially reinforced Fw-190s which were supposed to ram British bombers at night. The pilots were supposed to bail out after the collisions, but no one expected many survivors. The whole thing collapsed because the planes couldn’t find the British at night. They also had a program of mini-subs that were virtually suicide missions, and those to collapsed due to technical difficulties.
As I said above, the difference between the Nazis and Hamas is more one of relish vs. efficiency. The Nazis were good at genocide (relatively, anyway, and thankfully not that good; we still have some Jews left afterwords) while Hamas enjoys the prospect of wiping out a whole race a good deal more.
Comment by DavidN — January 6, 2009 @ 4:32 pm |
Why re-edit this piece? Was it because your exaggeration of Andrew Bostom’s comment meaning that Hamas is commited to genocide?
At any rate, Israel is killing Palestinians at a rate fare beyond what the Palestinians have done. When does this become genocide?
Comment by Marzowitz — January 6, 2009 @ 5:59 pm |
Mike #43 – You forgot the sarc tag.
Hamas and the Nazis share the same ideology, obviously. What’s even more frightening is that there are madrassas/Islamic schools/mosques here in the good ol’ US of A that are teaching the same foul spew to a new generation of American children. Defeating Hamas is just the first step on a long, difficult road to end this hatred everywhere.
Comment by inmypajamas — January 6, 2009 @ 8:30 pm |
DAvidN
Wilde Sau waqs about the use of day fighters for night operations who detected the bombers not through onboard radar like night fighters but through the light from searchlights and from the fires set by the bombings.
I have distant memories of something like you mention but it was not Wilde Sau and, AFAIK, was never implemented.
Comment by JFM — January 7, 2009 @ 12:08 am |
[…] Submitted By: Bookworm Room – Ron Rosenbaum.com/Pajamas Media – Some differences between Hamas and the Nazi Party […]
Pingback by Watcher of Weasels » Change, War and Corruption — January 7, 2009 @ 7:50 am |
[…] Submitted By: Bookworm Room – Ron Rosenbaum.com/Pajamas Media – Some differences between Hamas and the Nazi Party […]
Pingback by Cheat Seeking Missiles » Wednesday Reading - Gazathon Edition — January 7, 2009 @ 9:12 am |
No poor dumb bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his. This includes the people who elected Hamas and their population.
If you picked them, then it’s obvious that you condone their behavior. Remember boys and girls, you have to make the cost of war higher than they are willing to pay. Win by attrition. In the words of Forest Gump: Thats alls I got to say about that.
George Patton and Me!
Comment by Sigmeister — January 7, 2009 @ 11:00 am |
[…] on their investments, I’ll give them that. At the bottom of it all, besides the power, is good old fashioned anti-Semitism. I used to think that all the calls of anti-Semitism were a bit like the boy who cried wolf. But if […]
Pingback by Militant Islam Threatens Us All | Autumn People — January 7, 2009 @ 11:58 am |
Hamas is not like the Nazi Germany. You can make comparisons to any two groups under the sun and there will be similarities. I am sure google will provide me with a long list of how Israel itself is “Just like Nazi Germany”. It does not make it true.
Hamas is hamas. Its 2009! How many generations are you willing to sacrifice to settle old scores and revive old conflicts.
16 Million civilian Chinese died in World War 2. Still that event does not define China. Why does Israel continue to let that event define them. You sell yourselves short.
The author makes this false comparison for no other reason other then tug at the heartstrings of the reader. Dear Isreal play a different tune! There are plenty of victims to go around. Take charge of your own destiny! Stop looking to the past for reasons and solutions and look to the future and peace.
Comment by bigduke — January 7, 2009 @ 1:00 pm |
Another view:
Go ahead and fight to the death, as you say. You would end up dying, and for nothing. As I said, it has nothing to do with moral authority — you are merely choosing a side, good for you. I suspect you are the exact same type of person I was talking about. Too weak to accomplish ends, but sufficiently unstable to repeatedly threaten what you cannot deliver.
There is a reason that Hamas targets women and children. Go join them and see where it gets you. Certainly not as cushy as your existence here, where you are free to organize amongst like-minded folk and eventually support cowardly and futile strategies borne of military impotence. Nobody is saying Israel is or isn’t an occupier. All I am personally saying is that it’s not up to you to pronounce what is right and what is wrong. People will do what they can, and you yourself would wipe Israel away if it was in your power. But guess what? It’s not. And you have to deal with it. And civilized people ought to recognize the threat folks like you pose, if they value civilization.
You say that religion is a non-factor even as Hamas regularly quotes the Koranic passages discussing war between Jews and Muslims. Read it yourself. But remember that it is pseudo-religion you practice when you assign a moral consideration to Israel’s “occupation” but not Hamas. Ironically, a brutal Israeli offensive is the Palestinians’ best chance to live in peace and raise their kids in a secure and stable environment. But you go ahead and cite Grandma Hussein’s hard work if you want to. I guarantee you that Grandma Hussein would trade land for peace any day of the week, with all that she has seen as a Palestinian. It’s the youthful out-of-work Palestinian males who can’t seem to understand what is in their own best interest. Which is not really surprising considering they are young males who have no jobs. Perhaps if they ceased lobbing missiles they might get some economic development going courtesy of Israel.
Comment by LennyB — January 7, 2009 @ 8:53 pm |
<>
All of this is correct, though I’m pretty sure they tried a couple of times to implement the practice…it was just an abject failure. And I’m pretty certain they were trying to ram the bombers, I *know* I’ve read of them reinforcing the wing of an Fw-190 so that it would be able to do this and (they hoped) the pilot would survive…regardless, they did try things that verged on suicide tactics, but it wasn’t a widespread thing.
As for me not understanding that Hamas is evil because they haven’t actually been able to kill Jews the way the Nazis did, I still stand by what I said. If you read the whole post, I essentially said they’re wannabes, genocidal murderers who have (so far anyway) been unable to carry out their plans. I do think there’s a distinction to be made here, if not morally then rationally (in terms of what sort of threat they are). I don’t think we should take them lightly, but I do think that equating them precisely with the Nazis, or (as the author of the original article argues) insisting that Hamas is worse, seems a bit over the top. Hyperbole is the hallmark of our civilization, with every tragedy worse than any that has occurred in the past, and everything bigger, better, etc., than anything that has occurred in the past. Frankly, I think the bastards of the world are going to have to work pretty hard to be the worst ever. The Nazis set the bar pretty high.
Comment by DavidN — January 7, 2009 @ 10:19 pm |
[…] conservative Pajamas Media (hold your laughs). This is a site with such choice articles as: “Comparing Hamas to Hitler Is an Insult to the Nazis (Hamas is more extreme and more horrifying.” Are you kdding me? […]
Pingback by Joe the Plumber: War Correspondant « State of Affairs — January 8, 2009 @ 1:57 pm |
My most sincere congratulations. This article must be read for all those who make the analogy between Israel and the nazi party. The only analogous regimes in the Middle East are those who proclaim their desire to exterminate the jews and eliminate the state of Israel. Thanks
Comment by fusundo — January 8, 2009 @ 5:17 pm |
Nazis were far worse. The fact that Hitler tried to conceal his dastardly deeds doesn’t make him any less evil. I’d rather know the truth, like Hamas is doing, they hate Israel and they don’t try to hide it.
Comment by JackT — January 8, 2009 @ 10:54 pm |
[…] First place with 2 2/3 points! – Ron Rosenbaum.com/Pajamas Media – Some differences between Hamas and the Nazi Party […]
Pingback by Watcher of Weasels » Of War and Healing — January 9, 2009 @ 6:40 am |
[…] winning non-Council post was Pajama Media’s post, “Some differences between Hamas and the Nazi Party”. Second place honors went to […]
Pingback by The Glittering Eye » Blog Archive » The Council Has Spoken! — January 9, 2009 @ 7:22 am |
[…] the non-Council side, Ron Rosenbaum’s piece, Some differences between Hamas and the Nazi Party, won handily.
Pingback by Cheat Seeking Missiles » Watcher’s Winners: Hamas Week — January 9, 2009 @ 8:23 am |
[…] Charles at LGF and the dedicated Lizard Army have discovered a fake atrocity video.
Pingback by Crisis in Israel! « The Autopsy — January 10, 2009 @ 9:17 am |
I thought of another difference. Israel didn’t occupy Germany.
Comment by Josh — January 10, 2009 @ 7:34 pm |
Married for over 20 years to the daughter of Israeli parents I have come to understand Jewish ways and the threat of persecution. This latest conflict has encouraged perhaps millions of human rights activists that what Israel is doing is against international law, so it’s illegal and a “War Crime”, and because of media it has takes me much time and effort to try and explain to my contacts to the contrary. What I find amazing is that most of them are ignorant when it comes to history, Israel and the Hamas wish to exterminate all Jews. Perhaps if this was frequently publicized around the globe, eventually people would start to see the bigger picture and support Israel in masses!
Comment by Carl Boniface — January 11, 2009 @ 4:32 pm |
“Those Hamas rockets are glorified fireworks. I completely understand why the Arabs call us the Great Satan and want Israel destroyed. I don’t agree but I truly understand. Israel is a oppressive occupier. And I want none of my tax dollars going there way. Israel gets the equivalent to $10,000.00 a year per citizen in U.S. aid.”
After reading that piece of nonsensical tripe the amount went up to $10,001.00, and I’s searching my couch for change in the very predictable event you again say something that obtuse. If and when the Arabs decide to attack us again, dense PC clods like you need to be used as sandbags in order to protect the lives of people or vital facilities such as fire hydrants….
Comment by ipw533 — January 11, 2009 @ 5:52 pm |
But ‘Israel’ may have occupied Russia. This issue was raised in Radosh’s recent Pajamas Media post on ‘the re-emergence of the Stalin cult.’ Certainly at one point, with Trotsky in control, the Red Army looked like a Jewish Army. The rise of Nazism owed something to people having enough of the threat to traditional European values represented by the communist party, perhaps an earlier ‘liberal Jewishness.’ Stalin headed a Jewish identified force and could have been a brake on Hitler, but he betrayed his commitment.
The opposition to the Jew by the Arab in the Middle East owes something to the British policy of ‘divide and rule’ in appointing an antisemitic Mufti in their protectorate of Palestine. It also owes something to the Muslims ‘having enough of’ the Jews not accepting their dhimmi status. Thus the Nazis and Hamas have similarities.
Comment by Michael — January 11, 2009 @ 9:43 pm |
[…] Noncouncil: Ron Rosenbaum.com/Pajamas Media – Some differences between Hamas and the Nazi Party […]
Pingback by The Razor » Blog Archive » The Council Has Spoken: Jan 9, 2009 — January 13, 2009 @ 5:56 pm |
Hmm…62 years ago, given a few months, the state of Israel opened for business at the expense of all those who had already staked out the land for quite some time. Since then both sides have played a when-did-history-start, usually beginning it right after their contingent arrived. Same thing happened in Cuba,
China, and the good old US ‘west.’ There are rubber-stamps aplenty to go around, so any argument provides a sizable crowd of ‘ditto heads.’ Meanwhile the rest of us sit by and hope they don’t blow us to hell just because of whatever side we’re on. Bit tiresome if you ask me.
Comment by Mikhael — January 18, 2009 @ 2:52 pm |
Your right Mr. Rosenbaum, the ideology of Nazi Germany and Hamas, re: Islam, amount to the same thing, except that Hamas is more extreme.
Comment by RF — January 19, 2009 @ 3:17 am |
the meaning of hadith is quite misleading as prophet Mohammad did not wipe out jew during his time. The meaning should be apply during war time and place
Comment by light — January 20, 2009 @ 5:18 am |
Judgement day is came.
Comment by The fair — February 13, 2009 @ 12:52 pm |